Tube transmitter issues

Question

I'm back working on my friend's 807 tube transmitter. I've had some previous posts on this and I'd like to thank all the people who responded for your help!

I bought an oscilloscope and a dummy load and almost instantly figured out the power problem. It's the 807 screen grids. With the current schematic, the 807 screen grids run at about 100 V. Power output calculated across the dummy load is 4 W RMS. If I increase the screen grid voltage to 250 V, the output jumps to more than 10 W RMS. The tube manual for dual 807s, class A, calls for 600 V plates (which I have) and 300 V screens.

Here's the problem: When I increase the screen grid voltage on the 807s, the modulation disappears. In the diagram, you'll notice the switch that controls the 807 screen grid voltage, also controls the EL84 audio amplifier plate voltage. What is the correlation here? What can I do to fix it? Do I need more peak-to-peak voltage on my input? I'm currently using an old cell phone with a tone generator for testing. Input voltage to the jack and 12AX7 is about 1.5 V_p-p.

Any help would be appreciated! Schematic is below.

Answer 1

(Caveat -- I'm a toob fan-boy, but I don't have many actual tube circuits under my belt. They're just vacuum-mode FETs to me.).

The final amplifier stage is screen modulated. Either someone is mistreating the EL84 in the lower right corner of the schematic, or they're being very clever and you are under-driving the transmitter.

If you look at this datasheet you'll see that the EL84 is not rated for positive grid voltage. It pulls a lot of current at 0V on the grid, in fact. I was going to say that this is a Bad Thing, and that the biasing of the amp is all messed up -- but then I noticed the diode on the grid of the EL84 in the lower right corner (now, wouldn't saying "D1" be easier?)

If that diode is doing what I think it's doing, then when the transmitter is idling, there will be very little voltage on the screens of the 807s, by design. When you input audio to the thing, the peaks of the audio waveform at the grid of that EL84 will tend to charge up the capacitor on the grid of that EL84. Then on the next down-swing of the audio, the EL84 will conduct less, the 807 screens will go high, and you'll actually see some transmit power.

So -- try feeding it with higher-level audio, see what happens. If you don't have enough audio out of your cell phone, build or by an external amplifier, or add another stage or two of amplification to the transmitter.

When you increase the screen voltage (presumably by reducing the resistance from the screen to B+), then you reduce the audio gain in the screen circuit. That would be why your modulation disappears -- you're essentially shorting out the final stage of audio amplification.

Answer 2

Drive the screens for full output. Replace the modulation circuit with a modulation transformer in series with the B+ Use plate modulation and modulate the 807s with a 50 Watt audio amp connected to the modulation transformer

Answer 3

It's pretty simple.

1. for an 807 in class A, the screen grid voltage is 200V maximum.
2. You want to modulate the screen schedule. Beautiful. The EL84 should do that, but if you already supply a maximum screen grid voltage, the EL84 can't change that anymore. With a screen grid voltage of 200V, the EL84 can with a bit of luck produce a voltage swing of 100-300V.
3. The EL84 needs an anode resistance of about 5-7K to the plus voltage. But at a low screen grid voltage of 150-200V, the anode resistance is 15k. EL84 then produces little power.

In short, this scheme requires the necessary adjustments, but with this information you should be able to get at least 10 watts including music :-). It's never going to be great with this schedule :-( Good luck, Koos