# op amp positive feedback Schmitt trigger

I have recently come across the op amp Schmitt trigger presented in 3rd edition art of electronics. I decided to build the circuit myself in circuit lab, and I have some questions regarding its operation.

Schmitt trigger with one threshold

simulate this circuit – Schematic created using CircuitLab

First, when the voltage at the non inverting input is greater than the voltage at the inverting input, the op amp finds itself in positive saturation, and has an output equal to +5V. If the voltage at the inverting input is equal or greater than the voltage at the non inverting input (4V), then the op amp enters negative saturation, with an output close to ground.

Schmitt trigger with two thresholds-positive feedback

simulate this circuit

When the voltage at the inverting input is lower, and the op amp is in positive saturation, the threshold, or the voltage at the non inverting input is approximately equal to +4V. When the input is high, the output is low, near ground and the new threshold is equal with 9090/(10k+9090) x8V=3.809V , where 9090k is the value of 10kII100k. The AoE author says that this circuit works with positive feedback. Why does this circuit work with positive feedback only? I am not very aquainted to positive feedback, so can someone explain to me why this circuit wouldn't work with negative feedback?

• You can't have a Schmitt trigger with one threshold. Schmitt triggers always have two thresholds. Commented Oct 30, 2023 at 9:13
• @Andyaka-From what I see this only applies if you add feedback to the circuit. If you don't, like in the first circuit (which I have copied from AoE), then there will be only one threshold at the non inverting input, equal to the voltage divider equation, or 4V in this case. Commented Oct 30, 2023 at 9:46
• @DavidAb I would call the first circuit a comparator circuit (not a Schmitt Trigger). A Schmitt Trigger is formed from a comparator circuit by adding some positive feedback to it.
– user350400
Commented Oct 30, 2023 at 10:42