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Question(s)

Is the math below correct? If not, then what should be changed?

If you know of an authoritative reference for this derivation, then please post it in an answer, or in the comments.

Background

After lots of searching to find a good reference with a generalized solution to chain one S-parameter matrix's port onto another S-parameter matrix's port of another arbitrary size, I resorted (reluctantly) to ChatGPT, which provided a surprisingly good formulation.

The "interesting conversation" with ChatGPT concluded here.

(nb, I know that using AI to answer a question is not allowed here, but I am hoping that it is acceptable to verify an AI response, especially when they response is quite complicated mathematically and I want to make sure the result is correct before I use it in real life.)

Overview

The objective is to determine the new S-parameter matrix \$S'^Q\$ after connecting a \$P\$-port network to a \$Q\$-port network. This involves understanding how signals are reflected and transmitted between ports, considering both direct connections and indirect interactions through the attached network.

Definitions

  • \$S^Q_{ij}\$: The elements of the original \$Q\$-port S-parameter matrix, where \$i, j \in \{1, 2, \ldots, Q\}\$.

  • \$S^P_{ij}\$: The elements of the \$P\$-port S-parameter matrix, represented as:

    $$ S^P = \begin{pmatrix} S^P_{11} & S^P_{12} & \cdots & S^P_{1P} \\ S^P_{21} & S^P_{22} & \cdots & S^P_{2P} \\ \vdots & \vdots & \ddots & \vdots \\ S^P_{P1} & S^P_{P2} & \cdots & S^P_{PP} \end{pmatrix} $$

  • Connection: Port \$N\$ of the \$Q\$-port network is connected to port \$M\$ of the \$P\$-port network.

  • \$S'^Q_{ij}\$: The elements of the new \$Q\$-port S-parameter matrix after the connection.

Generalized Transformation Equations

The new S-parameters \$S'^Q_{ij}\$ are determined by considering how the connection affects each interaction in the network:

  1. For ports \$i\$ and \$j\$, where \$i, j \neq N\$:

    These interactions are modified by the connection through port \$N\$:

    $$ S'^Q_{ij} = S^Q_{ij} + \sum_{k=1}^{P} \frac{S^Q_{iN} S^Q_{Nj} S^P_{kM}}{1 - S^Q_{NN} S^P_{MM}} $$

    • \$S^P_{kM}\$: Represents the S-parameter between the \$k\$-th port of the \$P\$-port network and port \$M\$.

    • Summation over \$k\$: Accounts for contributions from all ports in the \$P\$-port network.

  2. For \$(i = N\$ and \$j \neq N)\$ or \$(i \neq N\$ and \$j = N)\$:

    These terms capture direct interactions involving the connected port \$N\$:

    • Transmission from \$i\$ to \$N\$:

      $$ S'^Q_{iN} = \sum_{k=1}^{P} \frac{S^Q_{iN} (1 + S^P_{kk}) - S^Q_{iN} S^Q_{NN} S^P_{kM}}{1 - S^Q_{NN} S^P_{MM}} $$

      This equation is used when \$i \neq N\$ and describes how signals from port \$i\$ are transmitted to port \$N\$ through the \$P\$-port network.

    • Transmission from \$N\$ to \$j\$:

      $$ S'^Q_{Nj} = \sum_{k=1}^{P} \frac{S^Q_{Nj} (1 + S^P_{kk}) - S^Q_{NN} S^Q_{Nj} S^P_{kM}}{1 - S^Q_{NN} S^P_{MM}} $$

      This equation is used when \$j \neq N\$ and describes how signals from port \$N\$ are transmitted to port \$j\$ through the \$P\$-port network.

  3. Reflection at port \$N\$:

    The reflection at port \$N\$ considers the connection to port \$M\$:

    $$ S'^Q_{NN} = \sum_{k=1}^{P} \frac{S^Q_{NN} + S^P_{kk} - S^Q_{NN} S^P_{MM} + S^Q_{NN} S^P_{kM} S^P_{kk}}{1 - S^Q_{NN} S^P_{MM}} $$

    This reflects the change in reflection characteristics due to the connection.

Resultant S-parameter Matrix \$S'^Q\$

The complete modified matrix \$S'^Q\$ is expressed as:

$$ S'^Q = \begin{pmatrix} S'^Q_{11} & S'^Q_{12} & \cdots & S'^Q_{1Q} \\ S'^Q_{21} & S'^Q_{22} & \cdots & S'^Q_{2Q} \\ \vdots & \vdots & \ddots & \vdots \\ S'^Q_{Q1} & S'^Q_{Q2} & \cdots & S'^Q_{QQ} \end{pmatrix} $$

Summary

  • Generalization: This formulation is applicable for connecting any \$P\$-port network to a single port of a \$Q\$-port network (\$Q \geq P\$), focusing on the interaction between port \$N\$ and port \$M\$.

  • Key Concept: The summation over \$k\$ accounts for the effect of each port in the \$P\$-port network, ensuring comprehensive modeling of the interaction.

  • Practical Application: This method is essential for analyzing complex network interconnections, such as those found in RF and microwave systems, where multiple networks are interconnected and interact through specific ports.

By following this framework, engineers can accurately model and predict the behavior of interconnected multi-port networks, capturing all possible interactions in the analysis.

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    \$\begingroup\$ This is one of the problems with ChatGPT. Now we know that somewhere someone has published or written something that seems to answer OP's question. But we can't look at the source so we can't judge whether (1) that source was reliable or (2) whether it has been accurately reported. AND we can't even provide a reference if we use it. (No, I don't know where you would find this). \$\endgroup\$
    – Fred
    Commented Aug 10 at 19:19

1 Answer 1

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The book “Linear Multiport Synthesis”, by Robert Newcomb, has the formula.

An N port network with its final M ports connected to an M port load…. Partition the N port network into 4 parts:

The upper left corner of its matrix is a square matrix N-M rows and columns. Call that s11.

The lower right corner is a square matrix of M rows and M columns. Call that s22.

The upper right part of the matrix call s12. The lower left of the matrix call s21.

Then the s matrix of the unterminated N-M ports is called Sin.

Sin=s11+s12 * sload * inv(I-s22*sload) * s21

This works with any number of ports. In particular, with a two port network terminated in a one port network, all the s’s are scalars, the matrix multiplication is just multiplying numbers, and the inverse is division.

But, it also works with a 8 port terminated with a 5 port, for example, resulting in a three port Sin.

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  • \$\begingroup\$ Thank you for your answer! Please clarify what you mean by "An N port network with its final M ports connected to an M port load". Which ports are connected between M and N? Maybe you can edit your answer to use the same variables in the original question so Port N of the Q-port network is connected to port M of the P-port network, so that the answer has parity with the question. Also, please fix the s21 problem. \$\endgroup\$
    – KJ7LNW
    Commented Aug 16 at 16:59
  • \$\begingroup\$ Kj7lnw: Ok, The original question is about connecting one of the Q port’s ports to one of the P port’s ports. The resulting network will have Q+P -2 unterminated ports, the two coming from the two ports which are now internal to the network, and are no longer “ports” . The original solution gives a result that is a Q port, which is obviously not the case most of the time. Q+P-2 does not equal Q, unless P is two. I see that I did not really answer the question. \$\endgroup\$
    – user69795
    Commented Aug 17 at 5:05
  • \$\begingroup\$ To use the Cascade s-parameter formula in this situation, rewrite the two networks, unconnected to each other, as a Q+P port s matrix. This matrix will have two big areas of zeros, in the upper right and lower left, ( because the two networks are not connected) . Now, renumber the ports, moving port N of the Q port to the last row and column, and Port M of the P port to the last minus one row and column. Then terminate this s matrix in a two port which is a strait through connection. This two port has an s matrix [[0 1]; [1 0]]. This is sload in the formula. Sin is the answer. \$\endgroup\$
    – user69795
    Commented Aug 17 at 5:26
  • \$\begingroup\$ +1. Apart from the solution, the advice of consulting Newcomb's book is the best advice on those matters. \$\endgroup\$ Commented Aug 17 at 18:10
  • \$\begingroup\$ I am not convinced that the answer as written addresses the original question, but editing your comments into the answer might do it. Please also use the same variables as in the original post to prevent confusion (so Port N of the Q-port network is connected to port M of the P-port network). If you can clean up the answer so that it stands alone without the comments then I would like to award the bounty. \$\endgroup\$
    – KJ7LNW
    Commented Aug 20 at 20:51

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