0
\$\begingroup\$

I am trying to get back into control systems and at the moment I am stuck on how to extract the damping ratio and gain from the Bode plot I generated.

enter image description here

Firstly the gain. As far as I can remember the gain is the value at f = 0, so 0 dB in my case. Is this correct?

The damping ratio can be calculated from the peak at the resonance frequency somehow, but I am unable to find a fitting formula here. So how can one find/calculate this value from the Bode plot?

\$\endgroup\$
7
  • \$\begingroup\$ Your circuit is slightly non-standard because of the 5 milli ohm resistor in series with the 20 uF hence, it's likely that if you want an exact answer, you'll need to derive it. If that 5 milli ohm were zero ohm, the damping ratio would be 0.0246 \$\endgroup\$
    – Andy aka
    Commented Feb 6, 2023 at 17:41
  • \$\begingroup\$ @Andyaka Thanks for the comment! How did you derive the damping ratio for the zero ohm Case? \$\endgroup\$
    – Amigo54
    Commented Feb 6, 2023 at 18:03
  • \$\begingroup\$ I made a web-calculator that does that \$\endgroup\$
    – Andy aka
    Commented Feb 6, 2023 at 18:05
  • \$\begingroup\$ Can you please share the analytic equation behind that one for the damping ratio? \$\endgroup\$
    – Amigo54
    Commented Feb 6, 2023 at 18:20
  • \$\begingroup\$ Will this form an acceptable answer because it's not a simple derivation to present. \$\endgroup\$
    – Andy aka
    Commented Feb 6, 2023 at 18:24

2 Answers 2

3
\$\begingroup\$

A 2nd order low-pass peaking plot with magnitude information can be found on my website: -

enter image description here

If you need more details of how that formula is derived I can add that information. I've added that now - see derivation #1 lower down.

So, the trick here is reverse engineer the above formula: -

$$P = \dfrac{1}{2\zeta\sqrt{1 - \zeta^2}}$$

And, if you manipulate this into a quadratic solving for \$\zeta^2\$ you get: -

$$\zeta^2 = \dfrac{1\pm\sqrt{1-\frac{1}{P^2}}}{2}$$

So, if the peak is 20 times higher than the DC value (a peak gain of about 26 dB) you get this: -

$$\zeta^2 = \dfrac{1\pm\sqrt{0.9975}}{2}$$

Clearly the wrong answer is found when the numerator terms are added. If subtracted: -

$$\zeta^2 = 0.00062539111 $$

And \$\zeta =\$ 0.025.


Added derivation #1


enter image description here


Added web calculator


This is a calculator (also from my website) that shows the actual damping ratio (\$\zeta\$). It's a simple case of adding the two resistors in the original circuit into one lump value of 0.0025 Ω: -

enter image description here

You can find the calculator here.

\$\endgroup\$
0
\$\begingroup\$

Your circuit is too complicated to solve analytically. I provided some guidelines and analyzed your specific circuit at the bottom of my answer.

Well, let's analyze this circuit:

schematic

simulate this circuit – Schematic created using CircuitLab

The transfer function is given by:

$$\mathscr{H}\left(\text{s}\right):=\frac{\text{V}_\text{o}\left(\text{s}\right)}{\text{V}_\text{i}\left(\text{s}\right)}=\frac{\displaystyle\text{R}_2+\frac{1}{\displaystyle\text{sC}}}{\text{R}_1+\text{sL}+\text{R}_2+\frac{1}{\text{sC}}}=\frac{1+\text{CR}_2\text{s}}{\text{CL}\text{s}^2+\text{C}\left(\text{R}_1+\text{R}_2\right)\text{s}+1}\tag1$$

Now, we want to solve for the value that \$\displaystyle\left|\space\underline{\mathscr{H}}\left(\text{j}\omega\right)\right|\$ is at a maximum:

$$\frac{\partial\left|\space\underline{\mathscr{H}}\left(\text{j}\hat{\omega}\right)\right|}{\partial\hat{\omega}}=0\space\Longleftrightarrow\space\hat{\omega}=\dots\tag2$$

Solving this gives:

$$\hat{\omega}=\frac{1}{\text{CR}_2}\cdot\sqrt{\frac{\displaystyle\sqrt{\left(\text{L}-\text{CR}_1\text{R}_2\right)\left(\text{L}+\text{CR}_2\left(\text{R}_1+2\text{R}_2\right)\right)}}{\text{L}}-1}\tag3$$

With the condition that \$\text{CR}_1\left(\text{R}_1+2\text{R}_2\right)<2\text{L}\$.

At the maximum we get:

$$\left|\space\underline{\mathscr{H}}\left(\text{j}\hat{\omega}\right)\right|=\dots\tag4$$

So, the cut-off frequency can be solved:

$$\left|\space\underline{\mathscr{H}}\left(\text{j}\omega\right)\right|=\frac{1}{\sqrt{2}}\cdot\left|\space\underline{\mathscr{H}}\left(\text{j}\hat{\omega}\right)\right|\space\Longleftrightarrow\space\omega=\dots\tag5$$

Which gives:

$$\omega_\pm=\dots\tag6$$

So, the bandwidth is given by:

$$\mathcal{B}:=\left|\omega_+-\omega_-\right|=\dots\tag7$$

And the quality factor is given by:

$$\mathcal{Q}:=\frac{\hat{\omega}}{\mathcal{B}}=\dots\tag8$$


For your specific circuit we find:

$$\hat{\omega}=1000000 \sqrt{\frac{\sqrt{1210366}}{11}-100}\approx122974.8895\space\text{rad/sec}$$ $$\left|\space\underline{\mathscr{H}}\left(\text{j}\hat{\omega}\right)\right|=\sqrt{\frac{3168 \sqrt{1210366}}{26375}+\frac{3485327}{26375}}\approx16.257$$ $$\omega_\pm=\frac{125000}{33} \sqrt{2 \left(6336 \sqrt{1210366}\pm\sqrt{48590017190881-44166063744 \sqrt{1210366}}-6970127\right)}$$ $$\omega_+\approx126707.9218\space\text{rad/sec}$$ $$\omega_-\approx119124.9685\space\text{rad/sec}$$ $$\mathcal{B}=\frac{250000}{33} \sqrt{6336 \sqrt{1210366}-528 \sqrt{174266351-158400 \sqrt{1210366}}-6970127}\approx7582.95\space\text{rad/sec}$$ $$\mathcal{Q}=12 \sqrt{\frac{11 \left(\sqrt{1210366}-1100\right)}{6336 \sqrt{1210366}-528 \sqrt{\frac{345895201}{158400 \sqrt{1210366}+174266351}}-6970127}}\approx16.2173$$

\$\endgroup\$

Your Answer

By clicking “Post Your Answer”, you agree to our terms of service and acknowledge you have read our privacy policy.

Not the answer you're looking for? Browse other questions tagged or ask your own question.